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is pulling about 1/3 of its troops out of afghanistan by next summer. nato wants the handover to take place quickly. although there are questions about their abilities, the afghans say they are up to the task. that international troops and the afghan government have been very active in our province. there have been a lot of reconstruction projects. foreign soldiers have been making their presence felt. people feel safe. we are ready to take control of our destiny. >> afghan military personnel hold talks with american officers. for months, they have been planning for the start of the u.s. withdrawa communication is still the biggest problem. but there is broad agreement on the plan of action. the u.s. has increased the pace of training of their afghan allies in recent months. the afghans need to be qualified before they can provide security. u.s. forces trained afghan policeman or retrain a pilot in five weeks. training provided by the germans in northern afghanistan last four month but i set demands that the basic standards should be similar. >> the sec
is pulling about 1/3 of its troops out of afghanistan by next summer. nato wants the handover to take place quickly. although there are questions about their abilities, the afghans say they are up to the task. that international troops and the afghan government have been very active in our province. there have been a lot of reconstruction projects. foreign soldiers have been making their presence felt. people feel safe. we are ready to take control of our destiny. >> afghan military...
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afghanistan but i think. it's a situation where not a huge negative effect on draco control particularly among those people who are linked with her but this guy in kandahar a moment ago. was a link to the cia it's often been said that he was a us puppet and had been working for the cia does this mean though that washington now has less control over afghanistan i mean how would they replace this undoubtedly influential figure. of course he was blamed to. pair off the cia as i mentioned before but he did night to be linked with c. to be working for a for a. c c. he confirmed that the. past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with american troops in america. particularly in kandahar because of this i think that americans lost one off there one of the important. members. of the or troops or. he had an important role in fighting against the taliban. militants insurgents in. afghanistan but at the same time he was accused of being involved in corruption in drag trafficking and everything be
afghanistan but i think. it's a situation where not a huge negative effect on draco control particularly among those people who are linked with her but this guy in kandahar a moment ago. was a link to the cia it's often been said that he was a us puppet and had been working for the cia does this mean though that washington now has less control over afghanistan i mean how would they replace this undoubtedly influential figure. of course he was blamed to. pair off the cia as i mentioned before...
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in northern afghanistan the most powerful person in northern afghanistan yesterday somebody killed the most powerful person in southern afghanistan there is no clear afghan leader in the north and now in the far more important the all important south there is no leader the canadians are pulling out the americans feel that they now have pacified this area and want to focus on the east they have relied upon. as their person their their man on the ground there is no one there right now someone in time is going to have to come forward there is no person right now with the stature of wali karzai generally speaking to oxy very recently the former chief of the pakistani intelligence service said the only way to ensure peace in the region is for the u.s. to hold direct talks with the taliban really interested to get your views on they smell the death of one cause and now force washington. that's a very interesting point for pakistan to say that because in the one nine hundred eighty s. when i worked as a newspaper reporter in afghanistan there were negotiations between the dean of the united s
in northern afghanistan the most powerful person in northern afghanistan yesterday somebody killed the most powerful person in southern afghanistan there is no clear afghan leader in the north and now in the far more important the all important south there is no leader the canadians are pulling out the americans feel that they now have pacified this area and want to focus on the east they have relied upon. as their person their their man on the ground there is no one there right now someone in...
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trying to now focus on eastern afghanistan feeling that they have controlled the south there is now a vacuum who is in power who can the west rely upon no one and i've also heard and others have reported that he was responsible for perhaps starting to bring the taliban together with the united states to negotiate therefore someone would have had a definite reason perhaps pakistan perhaps the taliban to stop this we don't know yet who is responsible because they killed the person who had all the information it's going to take time before we find out who's responsible but in the short term we do know that there's a power vacuum throughout all of southern afghanistan he who holds kandahar holds that country because in the one nine hundred eighty s. when i worked as a route newspaper reporter in afghanistan there were negotiations between the mujahideen the united states the soviet union and pakistan pakistan does not want to watch from the sidelines when pakistan says that there should be direct negotiations between the. it's in the taliban what it is also saying is that pakistan wants t
trying to now focus on eastern afghanistan feeling that they have controlled the south there is now a vacuum who is in power who can the west rely upon no one and i've also heard and others have reported that he was responsible for perhaps starting to bring the taliban together with the united states to negotiate therefore someone would have had a definite reason perhaps pakistan perhaps the taliban to stop this we don't know yet who is responsible because they killed the person who had all the...
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and nato forces in afghanistan. why they would want to kill somebody allegedly involved in the opium trade remains to be seen. however, having played all sides he's certain to have made a number of enemies over the years. charles? >> what do we know about the circumstances in which he was killed? >> he was killed -- homes -- i guess one of his guards shot him and he died soon after. >> i guess he was shot allegedly by one of his guards. meanwhile there's been an air strike in one of the parts of afghanistan. is that the work of nato? >> reporter: i haven't received word on where the strike was and if it was in reaction to this particular event. air strikes are ongoing here throughout the country particularly in southern afghanistan, where u.s. forces have been the contraiting on trying to eradicate the insurgency there and in eastern afghanistan they have a more difficult time to doing so. charles? >> carmen joining us live from cnn kabul. we'll take a break and update you with the selling on the european markets in
and nato forces in afghanistan. why they would want to kill somebody allegedly involved in the opium trade remains to be seen. however, having played all sides he's certain to have made a number of enemies over the years. charles? >> what do we know about the circumstances in which he was killed? >> he was killed -- homes -- i guess one of his guards shot him and he died soon after. >> i guess he was shot allegedly by one of his guards. meanwhile there's been an air strike in...
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and it's and it's happening at the same time as america says it wants to withdraw and leave a stable afghanistan yeah this is a high profile killing a man killed in his own house. you have to differentiate between stated policy and real call said you know. has been saying that it wants to withdraw for ten you know i mean going on for ten years they've been wanting to clear victory and leave but if the united states policy is actually to stay you have for the considerable future to control its natural resource you think they'll be there after twenty fourteen you. think what you think they'll still be there after twenty fourteen oh yes no doubt because it's a strategic. military base. in regards to china. russia all those central asian countries the united states' presence there is just far too important for national security interest for the united states ever in a foreseeable future. or i doug valentine us based your listener story and thanks for being on the program you're welcome. now two years ago i spoke to a while because about how he viewed the allegations against him. this is a drug in ob
and it's and it's happening at the same time as america says it wants to withdraw and leave a stable afghanistan yeah this is a high profile killing a man killed in his own house. you have to differentiate between stated policy and real call said you know. has been saying that it wants to withdraw for ten you know i mean going on for ten years they've been wanting to clear victory and leave but if the united states policy is actually to stay you have for the considerable future to control its...
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because of afghanistan. take decisions on the one hand you mentioned president karzai there why did the president seem to go out of his way so much to protect him . i didn't hear you yes why did the president karzai go out to be swayed to protect him so much. he wasn't going to protect him i think. because i do not have. he was not told get off with the media thing he had some personal dispute and personally. it. was. different stuff but. ok i will leave it there freelance journalist. says i live from kabul thank you for joining us here in our. thanks thanks. well the middle east peace quartet made up of russia america the u.n. and the e.u. has gathered in washington an attempt. to revive stalled israeli palestinian peace talks meeting comes at a low point in relations between israel and its biggest ally the us of the presence of bombers spoken favor of return to established pre nine hundred sixty seven borders. israel occupied vast swathes of palestinian land and a since declared the much of it as its own t
because of afghanistan. take decisions on the one hand you mentioned president karzai there why did the president seem to go out of his way so much to protect him . i didn't hear you yes why did the president karzai go out to be swayed to protect him so much. he wasn't going to protect him i think. because i do not have. he was not told get off with the media thing he had some personal dispute and personally. it. was. different stuff but. ok i will leave it there freelance journalist. says i...
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this is r t still ahead a few more trouble in afghanistan is the assassination of the afghan president's half brother a powerful politician allegedly linked to drug trafficking deals a blow to nato has plans to leave a stable country behind with troops withdraw for you also fears of greek style and rested it's only now we bring you inside of a financial woes of a country many predict could be next in line for the e.u. help. wiki leaks founder julian assange is back in a london court where he's appealing against an earlier ruling to extradite him to sweden the world's most famous was blows wanted there for questioning over sexual assault allegations but his supporters fear that if sent to stockholm he'll end up in the hands of the u.s. government is lauren that has the latest from outside the court building tonight. not so much has hired an entirely new legal team pull this appeal he's fired the old old lot and he's got people who are much more have much more experience in criminal law and they're much more concerned with the ins and outs of e.u. lore and specifically the european arrest
this is r t still ahead a few more trouble in afghanistan is the assassination of the afghan president's half brother a powerful politician allegedly linked to drug trafficking deals a blow to nato has plans to leave a stable country behind with troops withdraw for you also fears of greek style and rested it's only now we bring you inside of a financial woes of a country many predict could be next in line for the e.u. help. wiki leaks founder julian assange is back in a london court where he's...
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purpose is there are some chiefs of those units who we see here who are known for having fought in afghanistan in bosnia-herzegovina in chechnya you know iraq not in syria or libya some of them in the meantime have been detained for years in guantanamo created by the united states and brought on the spot to continue to fight so here the technique is always the same deal with the seas cities which are easy to supply located either on the coast or on the border and then they spread terror in the tunnel with snipers but they commit spectacular crimes of violence and barbarians which scare the whole population and they announced the creation of an islamic emirate in this city the eighty's to create basti and switch can be used after to penetrate further inside the country you can check it's happening like that because for example in syria there have been various companies zones actually oldest sons are located on the border and there has never been any fight inside that absolutely never and here in libya the events which broke out be can also in coastal areas allowing supplies and preventing these
purpose is there are some chiefs of those units who we see here who are known for having fought in afghanistan in bosnia-herzegovina in chechnya you know iraq not in syria or libya some of them in the meantime have been detained for years in guantanamo created by the united states and brought on the spot to continue to fight so here the technique is always the same deal with the seas cities which are easy to supply located either on the coast or on the border and then they spread terror in the...
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and it's and it's happening at the same times america says it wants to withdraw and leave a stable afghanistan the other is a high profile killing a man killed in his own house. you have to differentiate between stated policy and real policy and you know it. has been saying that it wants to withdraw for sure and you know i mean going on for ten years there have been wanting to be clear. what if the united states. is actually to steer you have considerable future to control its natural resource you think they'll be there after twenty fourteen year. think what you think they'll still be there after twenty forty oh yes no doubt because it's a cheap you own military base. it regards to china. russia all those social asian countries the united states person serious just ordered food for national security interests. over in the foreseeable future. so i dug vallance on us place your listeners store in thanks for being on the program you will. know two years ago i spoke to a because i have bad how he viewed the allegations against him. does it give a good work in august things but they never in the la
and it's and it's happening at the same times america says it wants to withdraw and leave a stable afghanistan the other is a high profile killing a man killed in his own house. you have to differentiate between stated policy and real policy and you know it. has been saying that it wants to withdraw for sure and you know i mean going on for ten years there have been wanting to be clear. what if the united states. is actually to steer you have considerable future to control its natural resource...
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know that still you have the somewhat unpopular position although changing rapidly about the wars in afghanistan and iraq what do you think are some of the messages that are really resonating the most people i think that i think in all areas when it comes to war more people are skeptical there's more votes now in the congress to protect home and bring our troops home from iraq and afghanistan and and surely not get another war started in libya so we've gained tremendous support there and i think the people of the country are agreeing when i talk about personal liberties people are more worried now about the patriot act and how the patriot act is used to harass us at airports and and pester spirit in the attempt to pretend that they're defending us and nobody really believes are doing much good but certainly on the economy in the federal reserve that's where. you know we've gained so much support because we have talked about the financial bubble that existed the housing bubble and that there would have to be a correction and certainly we're in the middle of that but we still face a lot of problem
know that still you have the somewhat unpopular position although changing rapidly about the wars in afghanistan and iraq what do you think are some of the messages that are really resonating the most people i think that i think in all areas when it comes to war more people are skeptical there's more votes now in the congress to protect home and bring our troops home from iraq and afghanistan and and surely not get another war started in libya so we've gained tremendous support there and i...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade doctor a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops american office because of this i think that americans lost one off their important members of the air troops but at the same time he was accused of. being involved in corruption and drug trafficking and then because of this many believe that america well seek a four for another person to replace him. well or two years ago we spoke to wali karzai about how he sees the allegations against him. because of this big but did never in the last seven years we tried. to music community reach out to your everyone. being approved while going through the video section of our website to access this interview in full. wiki leaks founder julian assange has a back in a london court where he's appealing against an earlier ruling to extradite him to sweden the world's most famous whistleblower is want
volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade doctor a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops american office because of this i think that americans lost one off their important members of the air troops but at the same time he was accused of. being involved in corruption...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with an american troops and american off because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the earth drops out at the same time he was accused of being involved in corruption and drug trafficking and then because of this many believe that american well seek for for another person to replace him. two years ago we spoke to karzai about how he sees the allegations against him. it is a drug. but. community and everyone. want to be free video section of our website that's what you can tell you and of course a huge archive of other news footage what is the. time now to check out some other wild headlines for you this hour a protestant rape has again turned violent in northern ireland's capital belfast as bonfires were lit to mark the annual twelfth of july celebrations protesters threw
volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with an american troops and american off because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the earth drops out at the same time he was accused of being involved in corruption...
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purpose because there are some chiefs of those units we see here who are known for having fought in afghanistan in bosnia-herzegovina in chechnya in iraq not in syria or libya some of them in the meantime have been on scene for years in guantanamo created by the united states and brought on the spot to continue their fight so here are the technique is always saying what they seize cities which are easy just apply either on the coast or on the border and then they spread terror and that's on with snipers but they are made spectacular crimes of violence and barbarians and which scare the whole population and the announced the creation of an islamic emirate in the city will here at least to create nastiness which can be used after to penetrate further inside the country you can check it zapping like that when because for example in syria there have been there east comfort zones actually oldest sons are located on the border there has never been any fight inside look at the absolutely never and here in libya and the events which we can also coastal areas allowing supplies there and preventing ameri
purpose because there are some chiefs of those units we see here who are known for having fought in afghanistan in bosnia-herzegovina in chechnya in iraq not in syria or libya some of them in the meantime have been on scene for years in guantanamo created by the united states and brought on the spot to continue their fight so here are the technique is always saying what they seize cities which are easy just apply either on the coast or on the border and then they spread terror and that's on...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops and american office because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the our troops but at the same time. he was accused of being involved in corruption and drug trafficking and then because of this many believe that the american secret for for another person to replace him. two years ago we spoke. about how he sees the allegations against him. but then never in the last seven years we challenge. community and we challenge everyone to approve log on to the video section of our website where you can access this interview in fool and of course a huge archive of other news footage. wiki leaks founder julian assange is back in a london court where he's appealing against an earlier ruling to extradite him to sweden the world's most famous whistleblowers
volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops and american office because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the our troops but at the same time. he was accused of being involved in...
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is to continuously draw attention away from it but meanwhile we've had iraq we've had as i mentioned afghanistan and we can all see what is happening in libya it is a case of controlling fourteen territories and i certainly hear from london and i know very well how the british empire has also operated in india and elsewhere on this divide in little basis it is standard those people who know about it can easily recognize it on the telly to yugoslavia the good news on the bad is the serbs about is so they have to be presented in that way ok mr ambassador going to you do you think all of the victims of that conflict are properly remembered because again i don't want to keep harping on the media but i guess i will. the serbs are just painted in the worst possible colors but a lot of serbs died in that conflict as well and they properly remembered because they were victims as well. you gentlemen have used the word serbs i never have the aggressor in this war i consider to belgrade and serbian not serve as a nationality but serbian as citizens or in this case as a regime i actually do not only knowled
is to continuously draw attention away from it but meanwhile we've had iraq we've had as i mentioned afghanistan and we can all see what is happening in libya it is a case of controlling fourteen territories and i certainly hear from london and i know very well how the british empire has also operated in india and elsewhere on this divide in little basis it is standard those people who know about it can easily recognize it on the telly to yugoslavia the good news on the bad is the serbs about...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in the media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade. a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops american author shells because of this i think that americans lost a lot of their import in. the same day he was accused all for. being involved in. trafficking and then because of this and then we believe that the now well seek for another person to replace him. well over two years ago we spoke to wiley about how he sees the allegations against him. because of drug dogs they did never in the last several years charlie charlie greta usually community we try to enjoy every one of these being the proof log on to the free video section of our website to access this interview in full. so we can leaks founder julian assange has a back in a london court where he's appealing against an earlier ruling to extradite him to sweden the world's most famous whistleblower is wanted for questioning over sexual
volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in the media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade. a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the u.s. . past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops american author shells because of this i think that americans lost a lot of their import in. the same day he was accused all for. being involved in. trafficking and then because of this...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to have killed me a political analyst from kabul told us the killing is a blown out of the us. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with the american troops and american off because of this i think that americans lost one off their important members of the our troops but at the same time he was accused of being involved in corruption and drug trafficking and then because of this many believe that the now american seek for for another person to replace him. who two years ago or two spoke to our karzai about how he sees the allegations against him. because of drug and obvious things but did never in the last seven years nor we challenge we challenge the international community and we challenge everyone to prove where the four we invited log on to our free video section of our website we can access that interview and follow also a huge archive of other news footage as well from r.t. . focusing on britain now outrage gr
volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to have killed me a political analyst from kabul told us the killing is a blown out of the us. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with the american troops and american off because of this i think that americans lost one off their important members of the our troops but at the same time he was accused of being...
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volatile region on the border with pakistan and was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade. me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the us. the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with her american troops and american officials because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the air to drop so that percent he was accused of being involved in corruption and then drac trafficking and then because of this many believe that the now american secret for another person to replace him. two years ago we spoke to karzai about how he sees the allegations against him. this it is a drug you know just things but they never in the last seven years know we challenge we challenge the international community and we challenge everyone to please bring the proof for that is that what you want to be free video section of our website that's where you can access the interview in full and of course a huge archive of other use for it but it is the far ok it's time now to check out some oth
volatile region on the border with pakistan and was often accused in media reports of having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade. me a political analyst from kabul says the killing is a blow to the us. the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with her american troops and american officials because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the air to drop so that percent he was accused of being involved in corruption and...
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province a volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused of media reports of a link to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul spoke to us he says the killing is a blow to the u.s. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with the american troops and american officers because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the earth drops out at the same time he was accused of being involved in corruption and drug trafficking and then because of this many believe that the now. seek for for another person to replace him. two years ago i spoke to us about how he sees the allegations against him. it was a drug in august things but did never in the last seven years nor we challenge we challenged the international community we challenge our everyone to please bring the proof where the for me will log on to the free video section on our website they can access that interview in full on the huge archive of other news footage from us as well. as a twenty three other news world the world news he
province a volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused of media reports of a link to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade talk to me a political analyst from kabul spoke to us he says the killing is a blow to the u.s. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with the american troops and american officers because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the earth drops out at the same time he was accused of...
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a volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused of media reports having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade look to have been have had me a political analyst from kabul spoke to us he says the killing is a blow to the u.s. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops and american officers because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the our troops out there percent he was accused of being involved in corruption and rack trafficking and then because of this we only believe that the now well seeker for for another person to replace him. two years ago r.t. spoke to a about how he sees the allegations against him. this is going to work in all these things but they never in the last seven years nor we challenge you challenged me to use a community of you challenge everyone to please prove where the for me but log on to the free video section on our website they can access that interview in full and huge archive of other news footage from us as well. so twenty three other news worl
a volatile region on the border with pakistan he was often accused of media reports having links to afghanistan's massive illegal drugs trade look to have been have had me a political analyst from kabul spoke to us he says the killing is a blow to the u.s. and the past couple of years he confirmed that he had a good relationship with their american troops and american officers because of this i think that americans lost one of their important members of the our troops out there percent he was...
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how important was he to the united states and to afghanistan? >> reporter: he was hugely important to his brother, hamid karzai, the president, because really, he was his eyes and ears, his political fixer in the south of the country. so really, for president karzai, he was a very important stabilizing and controlling figure in the south of afghanistan in the kandahar region. certainly there had been a lot of rumors about him, rumors that he was involved in the drug trade, rumors that he has built military forces that have helped on cia-led operations inside afghanistan, and he has certainly never been able to disquiet those rumors and they have been around now for a number of years. but this is a man who it's very hard to find people in kandahar who will say a bad word against him. when i was there asking government officials about him just before christmas, no one would say a bad word about him, which to me at the time felt very much like an indication that he was the real strong man in kandahar and really, that's the person that he was. wheth
how important was he to the united states and to afghanistan? >> reporter: he was hugely important to his brother, hamid karzai, the president, because really, he was his eyes and ears, his political fixer in the south of the country. so really, for president karzai, he was a very important stabilizing and controlling figure in the south of afghanistan in the kandahar region. certainly there had been a lot of rumors about him, rumors that he was involved in the drug trade, rumors that he...
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and, yes, maybe we've got to bring the troops home from iraq and afghanistan sooner than many here would like or that the president would like, and save substantial sums if we do that. most certainly if we're going to go forward with shared sacrifice, yes, we do have to ask billions, despite all of their power and all of their campaign contributions and all of their lobbying, maybe the billionaires who are doing phenomenally well may have to contribute to deficit reduction. yes, maybe those companies that stash their money in tax hyphens in pwerpld and the cayman eye hraldz -- in bermuda and the cayman islands, maybe they are going to have to start paying their fair share. on my web site which is sanders.senate.gov, i put a small letter which said to the president, mr. president, stand tall. take on these right-wing ideologues who want to make devastating cuts to working families. and in a couple of weeks we have 135,000 signatures on that letter, and i think that letter reflects what the american people want. they want shared sacrifice. they do not want to see the elderly, the kids or w
and, yes, maybe we've got to bring the troops home from iraq and afghanistan sooner than many here would like or that the president would like, and save substantial sums if we do that. most certainly if we're going to go forward with shared sacrifice, yes, we do have to ask billions, despite all of their power and all of their campaign contributions and all of their lobbying, maybe the billionaires who are doing phenomenally well may have to contribute to deficit reduction. yes, maybe those...